BlackBox vs. xPRO v5

Yes, the XPro is brand new, where as the blackbox is based on mature, widely used Grbl. The XPro supports larger stepper motors, and uses Trinamic drivers. It however will depend on the implementation, the XPro is sold out in the US so I can’t get it at the moment.
It really just comes down to the xPro being based on newer, still unstable tech and using the latest technology available, while the BlackBox is still an excellent choice, is older, matured, excellently supported and comes with great documentation and support. The blackbox is still based on the older 8 bit I believe (fine for all typical CNC applications) where the xpro is based on a 32 bit microcontroller, probably an esp32 I think. Different versions of grbl, so they are not compatible with each other.

 

Comparing the documentation, it looks like it's running grbl_Esp32 by Bart Dring, so presumably is an ESP32. But according to Spark (a grbl project sponsor), they had Sonny Jeon work on it, so whether that's stabilization/QA, or adding feature sets, I don't know, but I would assume the codebase is pretty rock solid. Mark announced his GitHub sponsorship of Dring on Twitter the other day, so I'm guessing that's the direction OpenBuilds are looking at too? Makes sense if the hardware is cheaper to produce/license than ARM, I'm not sure off-hand.

But BlackBox is very stable, Interface doesn't appear to have hardware support for four axes (which grbl_Esp32 can do), so it seems like OB are still anticipating BlackBox having a pretty good runway from here. Even if they did release a "BlackBox32" (which I've been guessing maybe pre-Black Friday 2021 for a few months, but anybody who knows ain't tellin') I very much doubt they'd kill support overnight. I'd think you have a very good chance of counting on at least two to three years of support from now for 8-bit grbl BlackBox no matter what happens.

The xPro5 seems to have very scant documentation right now. Not sure if/when they plan on fixing that, but between OB's BlackBox docs and Sonny's grbl Wiki, you can solve basically anything. xPro's more advanced features- 4 axis, ModBus VFD support, etc- don't seem to be a significant advantage to you, either. You don't lose plug'n'play-ability with either, though. They're both basically grbl boxes with terminal blocks, so no worries there.

I guess it depends on what you value more: documentation/support/longevity, or advanced features. If you see yourself adding a rotary axis or a VFD spindle in future (don't need to with a Kress, tbh), then you're pretty much forced to go xPro. If you want to know that probably a few thousand other people have the same unit as you, it's been tested in the field for a couple years already, and you can get answers from Peter about issues usually within an hour, BlackBox is the obvious choice.

 

I have that same spindle and it worked fine on the xpro v4 I have, would also work with the blackbox fine. The wiring issue can be confusing as it’s all in German except for a simple block diagram. It uses an analogue 10v signal, a ground and a reference voltage line of 10 to 29v (I think, I cannot remember the exact voltage). I ended up wiring 10v and ground to the xpro v4 and the reference line directly to my power supply. It works from about 6k to 25k, even though the min speed is 3500, but it shuts off below 6k. This may be an issue with my funky setup at the time

I fried one of the limit switch inputs on the V4, so I went with the 6 pack controller Bart designed and sells on tindie. In anticipation of modifying my lead 1010 (modification might be pushing it, I’m going to modify it to 4x8, so maybe call it a doner machine for parts), I switched to external drivers and monster nema23 steppers. So I’m not concerned about the drivers on the xpro or blackbox. The 6 pack is not without issues, the tmc5160 drivers (same as the xpro v5) have some issues, I do not believe the v5 has those issues.

while you can’t do it with the xpro or blackbox, the 5160s support auto squaring and sensor less homing (no limit switches). It can be a real pain in the *** to dial that in though. They also support quiet mode, coolstep, and a few other features that are nice to have, but not necessities. The 5160 is really a sweet driver, in the xpro it will support up to 6amp peak per stepper, although trinamics spec sheet notes the driver ic can support up to 15amp, that is dependent on the module circuitry and mosfets used.

I’m not saying the blackbox is bad or going away. But is is essentially a generation older than the xpro v5, and if you are getting something now, I figure you should just future proof yourself a little.

having seen the esp32 grbl code and configuring it, gives you quite a bit of insight into the newer code base (if you go with a 6 pack, you gotta build the firmware, I recommend using Platform IO rather than the arduino ide). Also I hang around BDrings discord server for grbl and his other projects. Fun group of guys.

 

I do envision a beautiful future where we have the Black Box with TMC5160 drivers (or something to power the big ones).
Its interesting the black box maxing out at 4.0 amps (according to docs) but there are famous Nema 23s that run at 4.2 (but im no stepper expert)

 

The current values provided are max current. If you drive your stepper at max current continuously.. you are going to end up with expensive paperweights.

As for the BB running a TMC5160, which uses SPI communication (it does support uart, but most of the CNC machines using the 5160s seem to be using SPI because UART is a pain in the ***). I have not seen any implementations of the 5160 using anything other than the 32bit controller, which means ESP32 as they are around the cheapest. At which point.. I give you the Xpro V5.

 

Hi,

are you happy with your xpro v5.
I am faced with the same decision.

regards