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C-Bot

Discussion in '3D printers' started by Carl Feniak, Sep 29, 2014.

  1. hax0red

    hax0red New
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    It's a simple design but I'm planning to use my Mini Kossel's stock extruder. It uses a 5.1 geared stepper that's capable of 160mm/sec retracts(haven't tried faster) and has been awesome in the fact that it's never given me a problem. I made up a new bracket that will clamp around the stepper motor and bolt to the extrusion eliminating the zip ties.

    I also want to try a wade style geared extruder in the future but will start with something familiar until I have the C-Bot in full swing.
     

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  2. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    Looks like you will all get built faster then me maybe. A fierce end of winter cold ripped through this house making the last few weeks a seemingly endless battle of kleenex vs laundry. I have proclaimed April 21 to be international build a printer day. I have hired a babysitter and sent the wifecountant away.

    Looks like I also have a smoothie board coming. A group deal on google delta group got a nice discount so I decided to see how the other half live. although it does not have it now, I believe that it is cable of JKN pressure setting, and XYE acceleration linking. That is basically the advantage of sailfish over marlin. On a side note, there may be some nice improvements to the .x3g protocols allowing for software based axis linking.
     
  3. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    How did aligning all those Z axis V wheels go? Fairly easy?
    You may want to leave some preloaded T-nuts in the rear Z frame assembly to attach a L or T bracket on the top of the frame for each cantilever arm. It will have a 1 cm mechanical advantage over the 90 corner bracket on the side (you could leave those there and have both). Also, remember to have some preloaded for mounting the Z endstop too.
     
  4. hax0red

    hax0red New
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    Hey Carl, I'm in the middle of printing my C-Bot parts and have ran into a few issues. A few of the parts are too large to print multiple parts at once so I need to break them up into multiple STL files. My question is are the 123dx files updated to the V2 versions? The file names in the C-bot zip file do not indicate a V2 version like the stl files.
     
  5. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    No, the 123D zip folder is not updated. What slicer are you using? With slic3r you can import the file, hit "split", and then delete items until they fit on your build plate. I almost always do this for multi part files as it also forces Z alignment at zero and displays if there are unattached part artifacts. I can update this tonight if you need. Let me know.
     
    #335 Carl Feniak, Mar 16, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2015
  6. hax0red

    hax0red New
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    Thanks for the quick reply. I use Simplify3D which doesn't seem to have this option so I'll try out slic3r. If you could update the files when you get a chance I would appreciate it(might help others avoid printing V1 parts as well). So far I have been able to highlight the parts I wanted in 123D and export selected as stl file but when I ran into parts with V2 in the name I decided to check with you before proceeding. This exact problem is why I'm building my C-Bot since my Mini Kossel will only print parts 150-160mm in diameter.

    adamcooks, I'm going to be using an Azteeg X5 running Smoothieware on my C-Bot as well. Also considering using 0.9 degree steppers but I'm not sure if the print quality will be any better with 1/16 vs true 1/32 stepping.
     
  7. hax0red

    hax0red New
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    Slic3r worked great. Was able to export the split V2 XY Idlers right and left to individual stl files for use in Simplify3D. Thanks again!
     
  8. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    Slic3r is also helpful for rotating (about Z only) and reorganizing build plates. There is also a handy Z split feature useful for chopping 0.2mm of a non flat part bottom or splitting a part in half to print it in two pieces.
     
  9. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    You can split parts in tinkercad easy.
     
  10. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/deltabot/xmyOb_gsmm4

    If anyone is interested in smoothie, this could be a good time. 25% entire order.

    I think I'm going to make a cutter out of mine, I'm not sure whether it will be rotary or laser, I'm sure I won't pass up the chance to run my c bot from it at least for comparison purposes. I got two thermocouple boards for it, it will be PnP with the printer.
     
  11. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    I've always liked the clean look and form of the Azteeg line, was just too cheap to buy one. For a 1.8 deg stepper, each step moves the belt 16tooth*2mm/200steps per rev/16 micro steps = 0.01mm, with 32 micro steps you'd be @ 0.005mm in the XY (technically in the 45 degree plane, but it is all relative). So though I have 32 microstepping on all my drivers it really isn't necessary for resolution. Some say it is good for smoothness though, but from 1/16 to 1/32 might not be a big deal.
    For the Z axis, some people recommend only using full step increments for your layer heights. I am not sure what is best as I still have 32 micro stepping enabled but only use full step increments in slic3r.
     
    Guilhaume likes this.
  12. MichaelS

    MichaelS New
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    Hi Guys-

    I thought I would add my two cents here. I've just got my build up and running ( more or less) and thought I'd post a couple of photos. Its got a 10"x10" bed w/ 500 mm lead screws & 84 oz./in. steppers. I printed all of the plastic (PLA) on a Prusa i3 that I built last summer. I have to say that this build was a lot more fun - and at times frustrating.

    Anyhow, thanks for sharing this design, Carl. She's a beaut.

    IMG_0706.JPG IMG_0707.JPG IMG_0708.JPG
     
    Carl Feniak likes this.
  13. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    That looks great! Interesting endstop arrangement, can we get better pics of those as they are a different approach then what I took (moving).
    What did you like the most?
    What was the most frustrating? Any Advice for others to make it less so?
    Deciding how to run the wiring was the biggest pain for me.
     
  14. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    Nice looking build. That black Vrail looks really nice. Good looking print with the yellow.
     
  15. MichaelS

    MichaelS New
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    No problem - here are some pictures of my endstops. I'd be glad to upload either the STL's or Sketchup files if anyone is interested.


    My frustrations stemmed from my own inexperience and ignorance - for instance the mini V wheels. After a lot of adjusting and binding and more adjusting I realized that there needed to be a shim between the 1/4 inch spacers and wheels. It seems obvious now, but I struggled with that one for a while. I didn't mind the wiring part too much, other than the wire wrap. With my clumsy hands that stuff is a bear to work with.


    I get a lot of satisfaction from solving problems I run into when working on the printer. At one point I discovered that the fan mounted to the back side of the hotend bracket would crash into the Y-axis endstop. So I had to go into sketchup and redesign the brackets for the endstop, print them out and then bolt it on and see if it worked. And when it does it's pretty great. But I'm not telling you anything you didn't already know.


    One piece of advice I might offer is to order some of the drop-in tee nuts from the OpenBuilds store. Those are great - once you've got the frame put together and squared it's no fun to take it back apart so you can load the regular tee nuts.

    X_endstop.jpg Y_endstop.jpg Z_endstop.jpg
     
    Carl Feniak likes this.
  16. MichaelS

    MichaelS New
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    Thanks Adam-

    At the time I ordered the V-Rail only the black was in stock. Yes, the Hatchbox yellow is nice stuff.
     
  17. hax0red

    hax0red New
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    Yeah I like the Azteeg but have my complaints. Their customer service was great at first then quit responding when it was time to figure out why my Kysan steppers were overheating when they ran cool on my ramps 1.4. The problem was never solved no matter how low I dropped the current to (0.3A minimum) and I now run fans on them but the high pitched whine is annoying. The new v1.1 board is said to have a fast decay mode which may take care of the problem.

    I agree on the resolution and I do run 16t pulleys on my Mini Kossel as well but I'm not sure I'm seeing true 1/16th from what I've read these guys aren't designing the boards correctly when it comes to really consistent stepping which may be a big contributor of my heat so this is a big reason I'm considering trying the 0.9 deg steppers. Plus a local shop will sell me 3 for $50 :)

    Thanks for posting your experiences building the C-Bot, it makes me feel a lot better about my build. I too assumed I would use the 1/4" spacers against the V wheel bearings but upon inspecting them out of package I noticed there would be binding. How would you compare the C-Bot prints to your Prusa so far?

    I too like the Hatchbox PLA when their prices are in the low $20 range but they have started gouging now that their popularity has risen. Back when they called themselves G-Star the PLA sold for $17-18 so obviously $21-23 would still be a decent profit. At $29.98 I can think of plenty of other quality brands to do business with in the US that don't play games with their pricing.
     
  18. Elmo Clarity

    Elmo Clarity Journeyman
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    Was going through the BOM in getting some orders ready. I noticed you list 'Tee Nuts, 25 pk' sourced from the Open Build Store. Just wanted to verify the size. I'm guessing M5 based on the number of M5 bolts. But will the build also need M3 tee nuts?
     
  19. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    All t nuts are m5. You may want to get a few drop in while your ordering, I wish I did. I ended up printing some, which I will replace for the final reassembly(tomorrow!!)
     
  20. Elmo Clarity

    Elmo Clarity Journeyman
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    Thanks. That is what I thought. Hoping to get the rails and t nuts ordered here next week. Will be sure to pick up some drop in ones too.
     
  21. ruggb

    ruggb Well-Known
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    The idler has one minor issue. The recessed hole on both for the M5 bolt into the center of a rail does not meet with the clearance hole. I attached them with sloped lines to make it solid. It would be better extended but I don't know how to do that.
     
  22. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    I am not 100% sure what you mean, but I did purposely leave thin membranes of plastic between the bolt head recession and the hole to trick slicers into bridging over the hole so that support isn't needed. I've found this works very well for slic3r, but not sure about others. Is this what you were referring to?
     
  23. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    The.2 layer in the counter bore is genius, btw.
     
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  24. bhalkett

    bhalkett New
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    Carl et al,

    What are you using or planning to use for a layer fan/mount on the dual extruder setup?

    Brian
     
  25. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    I have designed one that mounts to the rear plate of the XY carriage via a stand off arm (40mm fan). Currently I only have the left one installed but the right is just a mirror copy. The idea was to make them similar to the ultimakers.
     
  26. bhalkett

    bhalkett New
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    Carl,

    Are the files posted somewhere? I'd love to take a look at them.

    Thanks,
    Brian

     
  27. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    Didn't realize I hadn't shared them. Attached. I would make the arms a bit more rigid if I had to redesign them, other wise happy but haven't used two at once yet.
     

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  28. bhalkett

    bhalkett New
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    FYI...I just found out that Smoothieboards don't work with the "old" MakerBot endstops.
     
  29. adamcooks

    adamcooks Well-Known
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    So, it looks like my printer only IMG_20150323_113334.jpg wants to print in "magenta", looks way more like Nantucket Red to me. At least my daughter will like it
     
  30. Carl Feniak

    Carl Feniak Journeyman
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    Do you know why? Is it just a configuration thing where you have to enable/disable pull up resistors in your config?
     

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