I would not recommend this product unless you have a firm grasp on the programming side of things. I don't. Mechanical and electrical are no problem. I have been trying to contact Spark Concepts through various channels, for the past three weeks, but they seem to have gone dark. All of the products on their website show "not in stock" and the last time they posted anything on their support Github page was back in November, 2022. The initial purchase was made as part of a package deal, so the price was right. I'm in the process of getting a refund from the retailer and will likely purchase a Blackbox x32. Live and learn, I should have done more research first. I think their Github support page and the lack of replies pretty much sums things up.
If you do, welcome! If you have any questions shoot them over any time! See the Docs at docs:blackbox-x32:start [OpenBuilds Documentation] and the software overview at docs:software:overview [OpenBuilds Documentation] as an introduction Was it with the CAD/CAM side of things, or setting up the controller that you could use some help? We can take a shot if you want to
The CAD/CAM side of things is all good. I'm having issues with the controller itself. With the lack of support, I sent the xPro back today and a Blackbox x32 is on it's way.
Blackbox x32 arrived safe and sound. I've accomplished more in three hours, over the last couple evenings, than I did in three weeks of fumbling with the xPro. The Blackbox interface with Openbuilds Control is far superior to xPro's webui. I'm working through things one step at a time. Motors are all setup and running great, limit switches were next. Now I'm playing with the xyz probe. I've got a typical two wire xyz setup with a 50mm square block and it has a good connection to the bit, I've set the correct offsets and am using the custom xyz probe option. No matter which position I choose (corners, center) the spindle jogs +22.5mm in both x and y axes, it only probes properly when set to front left. Every other option misses the block and fails to make z axis contact. Am I missing something obvious? I'll make more attempts this weekend and see if I can get it sorted out.
The Advanced positions all probe from front-left too, the offsets are set mathematically. Note the wording of the onscreen text (and position of the probe in graphics)
I finally got everything connected and setup today and made my first cuts. BB x32 was a piece of cake, the HY VFD took longer. I'll likely do a post on it and all my settings in the near future. One question would be, why use relay 1 instead of the tool output to connect to the VFD?
Our official docs does not use the relays for the VFD. Some community writeups do, but properly configured, any VFD should only need 2-wire 0-10v signal The ones that do recommend the relay do so likely as they had their VFD configured to need a connection between two terminals, or the VFD had voltages over 3.3v present on terminals that would in turn damage the GPIOs of the controller
Im done with the xprov5 they did finally answer me after 8 days with some support documentation but it seemed every single step I took setting up that controller came with yet another issue, Most of it was probably needing a firmware update but i was holding off on that until I tested everything. Finally I decided to install the firmware and ran into yet another issue it would not install at all using their flash tool I sent them another support ticket and did not get an answer Im at day 13 on that ticket if it even went through, At that point I just gave up and just purchased the Black Box x32 along with the CNC interface touch to run my 1515 and HY spindle. Now I have to see what changes I have to make to wiring configs for steppers, Limits and how to connect the VFD for control in open builds software. Im learning a lot while doing all this but it was extremely frustrating when every single step i took with the Xpro was an absolute disaster so when it would not update the firmware and continued to fail I just gave up. I would love to actully run my machine someday . All my wiring is sheilded, all sheilding is drained, all wiring has ferrite on both ends and everything is properly grounded with copper grounding buses and tinned braided copper cables I spent a lot of time making sure my system was set up correctly and the Xpro v5 was a problem at every turn I would not recommend the xprov5 to anyone simply because the support stinks waiting 8 days and then 13 days with no response is no longer an option. When I send an email to OpenBuilds they answer me within the hour just like they did today. Im sure i will need some direction setting up the Black box but im really not concerned since I know the help will be there.
Peter I have a quick question Im about to start my install of the x32 black box and interface ...I noticed the black box has an ethernet port .. I have read that this port can control the box and it provides a better connection thats faster and more stable than USB . My question is will the Openbuilds software detect the connection of the ethernet connection or is there some configuring I need to do ? By not using the USB Im just trying to avoid some of the issues that go along with that type of connection.
That's not ethernet (8 pin RJ45) that's a UART on a 6 pin RJ12 https://docs.openbuilds.com/doku.php?id=docs:blackbox-x32:aux-serial Its actually for plugging in the Interface https://docs.openbuilds.com/doku.php?id=docs:interface:connect-blackbox-x32 Interface is our standalone (no PC required) controller: https://docs.openbuilds.com/doku.php?id=docs:interface:usage-instructions#video for a demonstration video In terms of Networking BlackBox X32 does offer Wifi: https://docs.openbuilds.com/doku.php?id=docs:blackbox-x32:wifi_setup (but USB is always the easier option and shouldn't have any issues, USB is reliable) You only use one "host" at a time. Either PC or Interface, not both, regardless of how the PC connects
So everything set up with the x32 and all is working very well limits are good homed the machine all good . Except Spindle control, When I power up my system my spindle turns on by itself and the only way I can turn it off is to hit the stop on the spindle itself it will not turn off in the software. So basically I have zero control of the spindle with the x32 and openbuilds software,. I just double checked my voltage with the mulyi meter and its at 10v.all my settings are as shown in Josh's video I have double and triple checked everything . I noticed he was running a regular black box and Im running the x32 did something change ? I also have the same VFD as him and all my setting in there are exact
Thats indicative that the VFD's "Min Freq" parameter hasn't been setup yet or correctly. Air cooled have a minimum RPM of 7200 rpm (below that air cooling doesn't work sufficiently). 7200/24000 * 400hz = 120Hz. Set the VFDs Min Freq parameter to 100/120Hz. Water cooled can go down to 6000RPM (6000/24000 * 400hz = 100Hz) Then its effectively off from 0-6000/7200 rpm, once commanded to go above 6000/7200 RPM it starts up. Once that resolves the start/stop - double check that does control the speed (if not spindle might be set for 0-5v instead of 0-10v, or some other parameters) We provide the 0-10v signal, the rest of the spindle's behaviour is all configured on the VFD itself
Thats exactly how I had it set PD011 Frequency lower limit set to 100.00 or 6000 rpm I also have it set in Grbl at 6000. I disconnected them reconnected and I do hear a click coming from the black box but the spindle wont turn on using the tool on command. Funny If I power everything off when I power back on the spindle starts up. also spindle is set for 10v and jumper is set properly as well to VI
Grbl settings should be $30=24, $31=0 (Else the scale will be all wrong. 0V=0RPM, +-3.3V=7200RPM=turnon, 10V=24000RPM)
I had $30 at 24000 and changed $31 from 6000 to 0 Same Issue Click but wont turn on What does this mean are these settings i need to change ?>> 0V=0RPM, +-3.3V=7200RPM=turnon, 10V=24000RPM
No, just explaing the relation between 0-10v scale and what spindle should do (and why $31 should be 0, to let the VFD handle the minimum startup speed instead, rather than offsetting the scale) Lets confirm the BlackBox side first: Disconnect VFD, put multimeter on 0-10v port like when you did calibration Then use CONTROL > Tool On menu: At 5% you should see 10v * 5% = +- 0.5V At 10% around 1V At 50% around 5V At 100% it should be around 10V At 0% it won't quite go down to 0, it always have a couple millivolt present (that kicks on a VFD if Min Freq is not working, but with Min Freq set up it will not kick on the VFD) Some variance expected, (purely analog PWM to Voltage converter onboard) but just to confirm the Grbl Settings are correct, you should see that. If that does happen, then the BlackBox/Grbl side is correct Clicking is the onboard relays (Same tool on command for spindle, is used for Plasma etc - so you have nothing wired to the relays, they will still click because other applications use them - its a good audible confirmation that Tool Enable was triggered, but not used with standard VFD wiring (0-10v signal only, VFD uses its intelligence to decide what to do based on the voltage on the wire as descibed in 0V=0RPM, +-3.3V=7200RPM=turnon, 10V=24000RPM) I'd prefer we get Min Freq working right on the VFD - you can wire the Relays into the mix, but it sort of complicates it, should just be a matter of the correct parameters and then its also protected from accidental commands with too low RPM - more the "right" way to do it.
Ok so at 100% it was stable at 10v .... at 5% It bounced from 0 to 1 which seems normal ....At 10% it stayed on 0....at 50% it was all over the place going from 0-9 bouncing around never leveled out. At 100% tested again it held on 10v
And thats with VFD disconnected? Any other Grbl Settings changed from defaults (like for example the PWM freq etc?) Using a good clean power supply like our recommended Meanwell? Your xPRO issues was VFD related too? If so maybe faulty VFD damaging the controllers (2 in a row, with a shared accesory is suspect)
Yes the VFD was disconnected and turned off. The XproV5 Issues were across the board every time I got to a step in configuring the Xpro x,y,z, movement, Limit Switches, Homing, Connecting, Firmware install you name it nothing worked. With that being said in CNC Commander software I was able to turn the Spindle on and off I just did not have any speed control. I did reset my configuration in OB Software. I selected Lead 1515 and then input all my values in again just in case anything got changed. What should PWM value be ? are there any other values in grbl in OB software I need to look at ? Was anything weird about the numbers/Voltages I posted ?
Ok Paul so what I have just done is used the relay 1 port COM to DCM ,,,NO to FWD and I am able to start and stop the spindle in the open builds software. Now Im trying to figure out how to control speed and Ill be ready to roll . When I start up the spindle on 50% or any percentage for that matter, it goes up to full speed no matter what. When I try to bring the speed percenatghe down it stays at full speed
That is somewhat similar here, so lets bare it in mind as we continue Stock standard is a good start (5000) or could try 1000. Profiles doesnt fix all values, so question is more what else was changed manually. If its a lot, EEPROM reset (button on Grbl Settings tab) followed by loading machine profile should help get it all back to defaults Yes: 50% should be +-5V. Like within a couple percent. Not 0-9v. That might be some abnormal settings, or the VFD caused damage to the 0-10v output.
So I ran some more tests ... I tested all the voltages from the x32 to the VFD while connected and they were all pretty spot on with no variances. so 25% was steady at 2v 50 % was steady at 5v and 100% was steady at 10v. only issue still remains speed control even though the input voltages are correct the spindle speed is not adjusting at all. Is that voltage input on the VI port of the spindle the only way to control speed or has that now changed since Im using the realy 1, Also the settings in grbl $33 34 35 and 36 needing to be changed ? Alsdo Paul I very much appreciate the time you have taken to help with this issue this has been very frustrating form the weeks of dealing with the Xpro ... The spindle has been the only real issue with the x32 and we are down to speed control ans the final hurdle.
Sounds better. Dont mess with the defaults. Those others are for Servos (documented here docs:blackbox-x32:connect-rc-servo [OpenBuilds Documentation]) needlessly changing defaults just adds to everyones frustrations as we presetup things to be universal. If VI is present VFD is ignoring it, its still VFD parameters. Freq Source parameter most likely
Relay 1? I do hope you read what I said above. Can, but shouldn't. Hoping you did not skip Min Freq config. Will refer you back to conversation if we ever hear your spindle burned windings or popped the VFDs IGBT. Do it right
Paul Relay 1 was the only thing that worked I tried min Frequency and could not start or stop the spindle and as I stated the only way the spindle came on was when I hit the power to start the system up and the only way to stop it was with the control panel on the VFD. The Relay 1 is connected to the DCM (GND) and FWD to NO. I will look for Frequency Source in the VFD manual ...Do you happen to know what PD??? number that is ? EDIT I looked right past this when reading the VFD manual for the 20th time But PD001 (source of run commands) and PD002 (source of Operating frequency) are both set correctly on my VFD at `1 .... 1 being equal to control via External terminal.
I did not skip min frequency config why would I do that ? I have my x32 and black box connected exactly like this below which I just saw in another thread . I also have my HY programmed like this as well. Still cant control Speed So is what your saying here wire the GND to Relay 2 and the NO to Relay 1 ?
My PD070 was the setting I got wrong I have it written in my notes everywhere to set it to 1 and it needed to be set to zero. I have done a lot of VFD resets just in case and I kept setting this **** thing to 1
