Welcome to Our Community

Some features disabled for guests. Register Today.

BlackBox X32

Discussion in 'Other Builds' started by OpenBuilds, Nov 23, 2022.

  1. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Well, Blackbox 32X, is not really plug and play, but after a while, all is working fine, homing, probe, end-stops, spindle with VFD, coolant, all is ok.
    The only thing i had with 4X is opendoor safety with parking head and auto resume function. I tried to use grblHAL Web Builder to add this function, but the bin file is not working fine.
    Why not include in Openbuilds under firmware wizard an option to install such a file with 32X box ?
     
  2. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    That is in the works, but the bin from Web Builder should work. Are you sure you are setting the correct options?
     
  3. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    I think so. This is for a Genmitsu PROVerXL 4030, i choosen 3 axes, ganged motor Y, probe ans safety door checked, SD Card enabled ans WebUI v3.
    I received 3 bins, bootloader, partitions and firmware, this is the one i installed with openbuilds and go plenty errors. Will retry after your advice.
     
  4. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Correct firmware.bin. Post log if you have trouble.
     
  5. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Made it. I had to modify some connections. The spindle (with A2 VFD) was connected on 0-10V and Tool connector, now is on 0-10V and relay 2 (but NC when spindle is off, odd...)
    The door open works with an emergency button (NC), but the only effect is stopping the spindle moves, still rotating and staying in place. The grbl door and parking motion you created for the 4X was much more sophisticated and so much appreciated. I would like to modify it as, but it is out of my power...
    This is the firmware zip i got with grblHAL Web Builder
     

    Attached Files:

  6. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Custom parking requires manual recompilation. Checkout github.com/grblHAL
     
  7. Lerronious

    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2018
    Messages:
    11
    Likes Received:
    1
    I made a few assumption regarding how "Relay 1" operates so am now trying to find a way to safely turn the spindle on/off. So a quick question, do the M3/M5 commands that open and close "Relay 1" also operate on "Relay 2" (BBX32)?
     
    #127 Lerronious, Apr 5, 2023
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2023
  8. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    No, M3/M4 operates Relay 2
    We don't recommend putting spindle "ARM" under software/relay control though! (bad things can happen if relay accidentally enables while you have your hand on the collet doing a bit change. We much prefer a panel mount safety arm/disarm switch to handle the Enable of the VFD) but if you insist, you can recompile grblHAL to swop Relay1 and Relay2's pin assignment putting Spindle Enable on Relay2: ESP32/BlackBoxX32_map.h at 8f4f19795e9e86df75bb53326de6747e774b21e9 · grblHAL/ESP32
     
  9. Lerronious

    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2018
    Messages:
    11
    Likes Received:
    1
    Yeah, that is how the MicroMill 2000 was originally configured, a toggle switch on the frame was used to manually turn the spindle on/off. When resurrecting with the X32, I was hoping to automate that task with a standalone 24VDC/120VAC relay switched by either the "Relay 1" or "Relay 2" channels on the X32. It seems like the correct way to do this is to use an optically isolated 3.3VDC/120VAC-10A relay connected to the "Tool" channel. Is this correct or are you suggesting to kiss and go back to the original toggle switch. BTW, the DC motor turning the spindle is 1/8HP drawing 1.8 amps.
     
  10. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Personally, switch for me. I really don't want my spindle accidentally activating. Even a small spindle can still skin a finger
     
    Lerronious likes this.
  11. DonLinTX

    DonLinTX New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2015
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    3


    After some Life delays, I am finally working on my R7 conversion from tinyG controller to the X32. I wired my Y1/Y2 motors, in parallel, to the x32 Y and the X, and Z per docs. This will allow a future A Axis for a rotary.I like options
    Also adding home/limit switches and a full Probe setup.

    Have set the overall limits of travel per the old tinyG settings and converted the tinyG's mm/rev (~8.0mm/rev) to X32's Step/mm. Motors are direct drive to ACME 4-start rod for ~8mm/rev. (200 Steps/rev / 8 mm/rev = ~24 Step/mm) settings. The tinyG used 8 micro stepping so am thinking now that it should be 1600 steps/rec/8, so will try that tonight.
    So far, no smoke but motors just bump when I try to move them, with Control. The motors were wired the same as tingG [A+, A-,B+,B-]. Motor power set to Factory levels, mid scale. I would expect to have to increase Y power, due to 2 motors sharing the driver.

    I have set the overall limits of travel per the old tinyG settings and converted the tinyG's mm/rev to X32's Step/mm. Motors are direct drive to ACME 4-start rod for ~8mm/rev. But....The tinyG used 8 micro stepping so am thinking now that it should be 1600 steps/rev / 8 mm/rev, so will try that tonight.

    I am also looking at a switch ganged for using the Water cooled spindle motor controller or JTech 2.8W laser head, switching to convert from spindle speed control to laser power. Maybe a simple 3PDT switch on the 0-10V output signal, along with an LED to show the mode setting.
     
  12. Alex Chambers

    Alex Chambers Master
    Moderator Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,780
    Likes Received:
    1,360
    Check that $4=0 to get the motors moving. Not going to answer your other points as its bedtime here in the UK, but I'm sure someone from a different time zone will chip in soon.:sleepy:
    Alex.
     
    DonLinTX likes this.
  13. DonLinTX

    DonLinTX New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2015
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    3
    That worked, along with correcting the steps/mm to ~200. Mine are a little under that at 199.98.
    Now just some finish wiring on limit/home switches and about ready for a test run. The x32 docs could use some additional notes like this and other setting that may need adjustment, but hey, that is part of the fun getting these things running. Thanks for the help.
     
    Alex Chambers likes this.
  14. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    That settings are documented in the Grbl and grblHAL Wikis :)

    Of course just picking the nearest similar machine from CONTROL > Grbl Settings > Select a machine dropdown would have been the preferred method. Even the CUSTOM option would have got you going faster :)
     
  15. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Well, my Blackbox X32 is working, but when i try to insert my wifi parameters i have a crash, even the Web Builder was not fine, i came back to the firmware from Openbuilds Control.
    So, no way to have a wifi connexion and the door button on my 4X was fantastic, a pause with a parking, then i could continue the job. This function (developed by Peter) is really necessary for me. I have a true emergency button who stop all electrical connexion to my cnc too. So i will come back to 4X to secure my milling process. I am not able to modify the grblHal, and i would like to know if someone created this patch to pause the machine with the door open button for the X32 ?
     
  16. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Wasn't developed by me, but I think I helped you customize it (beyond our standard expected service, so please note it might not happen again) - all grbl flavours have always had Parking and Door built in, its not my feature

    Door is enabled in the WebBuilder: (Tick Safety Door Input)

    [​IMG]

    Build with all the other options you need (Ganged Y, etc)
    Flash using CONTROL > Wizards and tools > Firmware flashing tool


    Parking can be configured in grblHAL - I've not done it myself yet, so : core/config.h at master · grblHAL/core may apply, or grblHAL/hal_setting_codes_en_US.txt at master · terjeio/grblHAL and
    grblHAL/hal_setting_codes_en_US.txt at master · terjeio/grblHAL - not sure myself, if you need specific help, might want to checkout Issues · grblHAL/core

    For wifi you do want the WebBuilder version too, CONTROL's included binaries are a little older and not caught up yet, we might not always try to stay up to date, because grblHALs Web Builder is amazing and 100% up to date
     
  17. Kevin Henning

    Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2016
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    2
    I noticed earlier in the forum that wifi connectivity can sometimes be an issue. Is this still the case? I am starting to shortlist some replacements for my XPro V2. I know that the folks who make the Duet Wifi experienced that with the original design and have changed the board to support an external wifi antenna.
     
  18. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    No issue as long as you grab the latest firmware
     
    Kevin Henning likes this.
  19. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    That is true, latest firmware from Web Builder correct all and wifi connexion too.
    Nevertheless, if safety door input is included, with Openbuilds Control, when activated i got a loss of Homing coordinates, and from Interface, the Jog dont work anymore. I would like to have a raising of Z axe too...
    Another tiny bug, when clicking 'Goto XYZ 0', no way to jog correctly in 3 directions (X+, Y+, Z+).
    Also, with Interface, when clicking 'Goto XYZ Zero' it start with lowering Z then moving to XY 0. When you have clamps installed, it can be dangerous for the end mill, a better choice could be to move to XY 0 then lower the Z, don't you think ?
     
    #139 Baroudeur, May 7, 2023
    Last edited: May 7, 2023
  20. Kevin Henning

    Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2016
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    2
    Actually, the issue I am referring to is where, in post #24 you indicated that, because the antenna is inside the case you need to ensure that the unit is placed relatively close to an access point to ensure the signal strength is sufficient.
     
  21. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    One would be expected to be inside wifi coverage yes. But post #24 dealt with a customer with network issues, not the run of the mill :) context is important when reviewing older posts. Troubleshooting steps (check signal) might not be the resolution to a person's issues - just one of possibly many steps to resolution. Dec is a long time, many CONTROL versions and grblHAL firmware updates ago :)
     
  22. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Right, so @Baroudeur

    1) First off, wire a NO switch to the Door Input. grblHAL expects the switch to close GND and SIG on the Door input when the door is closed - before anything else will work. Forgetting to wire this switch and making sure the door is closed (and that the closed door closes the switch) will cause issues when you try to connect (as grblHAL will be in a paused state)

    2) In CONTROL V1.0.368 (coming out later today)
    • CONTROL > Wizards and Tools > Firmware Flashing tool > X32 tab > Select "2/3 Axes CNC/Laser: Dual-Y with Door Switch"
    • Continue to Flash the firmware (other than this change above), as described in section 7.1 of the BlackBox X32 documentation
    3) Optionally: Setup Parking:

    • Connect and go to the Grbl Settings tab (if Grbl Settings tab is not displayed, check (1) above)
    • Modify settings $41, $42, $56, $57, $58, $59, $60, $61, $392, $393 as needed

    grblHAL way:
    $41: Parking cycle as bitfield where setting bit 0 enables the rest: ;unknown
    [20:14:06] [ $I ] 0 - Enable (1)
    [20:14:06] [ $I ] 1 - Enable parking override control (2)
    [20:14:06] [ $I ] 2 - Deactivate upon init (4)


    $42: Parking axis: ;unknown
    0 - X (1)
    1 - Y (2)
    2 - Z (4)

    $56: Parking pull-out distance in mm ;unknown
    $57: Parking pull-out rate in mm/min ;unknown
    $58: Parking target in mm, min: -100000 ;unknown
    $59: Parking fast rate in mm/min ;unknown
    $60: Restore overrides as boolean ;unknown
    $61: Safety door options as bitfield: ;unknown
    0 - Ignore when idle (1)
    1 - Keep coolant state on open (2)


    $392: Spindle on delay in s, range: 0.5 - 20 ;unknown
    $393: Coolant on delay in s, range: 0.5 - 20 ;unknown


    Old Grbl 1.1 way
    #define ENABLE_SAFETY_DOOR_INPUT_PIN // Default disabled. Uncomment to enable.
    #define SAFETY_DOOR_SPINDLE_DELAY 2.0 // Float (seconds)
    #define SAFETY_DOOR_COOLANT_DELAY 1.0 // Float (seconds)
    // #define INVERT_CONTROL_PIN_MASK ((1<<CONTROL_SAFETY_DOOR_BIT)|(1<<CONTROL_RESET_BIT)) // Default disabled = normally open so leaving commented out
    #define PARKING_ENABLE

    #define PARKING_AXIS Z_AXIS // Define which axis that performs the parking motion
    #define PARKING_TARGET -10.0 // Parking axis target. In mm, as machine coordinate [-max_travel,0].
    #define PARKING_RATE 3000.0 // Parking fast rate after pull-out in mm/min.
    #define PARKING_PULLOUT_RATE 1000.0 // Pull-out/plunge slow feed rate in mm/min.
    #define PARKING_PULLOUT_INCREMENT 5.0 // Spindle pull-out and plunge distance in mm. Incremental distance.


    Result
    Putting the two together, I think the old config I did for you should translate as (At your own risk, and if needed - modifications are on you but please do report back if anything needed changing)
    $41=2; Enabled with Override
    $42=4; Park the Z axis
    $56=5.0; Parking pull-out distance in mm
    $57=1000.0; Parking pull-out rate in mm/min
    $58=-10.0; Parking target in mm
    $59=3000.0; Parking fast rate in mm/min
    $60=0; Restore overrides as boolean
    $61=0; Safety door options as bitfield
    $392=2.0; Spindle on delay in s
    $393=1.0; Coolant on delay in s

    That would also be (1) above - fix the switch first!


    That's the Parking section, described in (3) - grblHAL doesn't need custom firmware - just the right settings
     
    #142 Peter Van Der Walt, May 8, 2023
    Last edited: May 8, 2023
  23. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Thank you for all your precise explanations !
    Feed Back :
    Parameter $42, the number 4 is not accepted Error 52 , undefined $42 = 4
    Then trying to move at XYZ 0 (working point), fast jog on X, Y and Z, then trying to move a bit the X on left, i got Error 15 (jog target exceeds machine travel). And my parameters are fine $20 and $21 enabled ( ihave a physic end stop on homing place) $22=1, and my $130,131,132 are correct
    I am so sorry to bother you again, you are so active here, i apologize
     
  24. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Turn off Soft Limits for now. Get it all working correctly first. Soft limits needs Homing, Homing Dir and Max Travel correctly configured, it references Machine Coordinates not Work Coordinates
     
  25. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Without soft limits, the head bump on sides where there is no switches. I just have switches on homing position and Homing, Homing Dir and Max Travel correctly configured
    Will restart after a sleep (often it is a good solution). Anyway the $42 can't be set at 4 so far.
    And i have a question, on the 32X, the door led is lighted when door is closed or open ? On mine it is up when door closed.
     
    #145 Baroudeur, May 8, 2023
    Last edited: May 8, 2023
  26. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Try othee values until Z is the Parking axis. Maybe 2?
    Should he lit when the switch is closed (SIG to GND)
     
  27. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ok, another feedback
    1 - Door connector is connected to an emergency push button and wired NC while pending, so far, so good, it works. I undestand now, with GrblHal all connectors needs NC when starting (switchs, door, etc)
    2 - When soft switch is disabled, all works fine. When enabled, after moving head, and trying to move it again, Error 15 (jog target exceeds machine travel) is poping
    3 - With modifications you provided ($41,42, 56, et...) pressing door button, stops spindle and axes, but Z raising is not making the job, and tool led stay on, and this when piloted by computer or Interface.
    4 - $42 accept only 0, 1 and 2
    5 - With Interface, moveto XYZ 0 make a retract Z to job coordinates, it is safer to have a Z retract to machine coordinates to prevent collisions with clamps. This must be in interface firmware i suppose.

    We are on the good way ! I propose modifications to a Genmitsu PROVerXL working with a Blackbox X32 on my channel, and for beginners this safety door push button is really something needed and can decide futur buyers to get this box allowing much more connexions than the original controller permit.
     
  28. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    14,927
    Likes Received:
    4,291
    Yes, not related. It moves to Z+5 first (Usually up and out of the cut) and then XY (has forever)


    Door switch for an enclosure's door yes. Button no - false sense of safety. In a real emergency an emergency switch (button) should cut power!

    Means you still have some work to do. If your old controller was setup perfectly, did you use CONTROL to transfer the settings (Backup settings on old one, Restore Settings on new one - CONTROL makes needed changes on the fly)
     
  29. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    I have 2 emergency buttons, main one cut power, and second (door) acts like a more sofisticated pause button, allowing to replace dustshoe for exemple. (i have no enclosure)

    I made this too, same problems.

    A bigger raising (like 15 or 20) could be safer for materials.
     
    #149 Baroudeur, May 9, 2023
    Last edited: May 9, 2023
  30. Baroudeur

    Baroudeur New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2021
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hail again
    I have tested the last version 1.0.370 and still a tiny problem with door button.
    It stops the work, shut off spindle, but no parking even after inserted new parameters as explained in the 32X documentation for door. The pause and continue works too but no parking. Also, if door button is activated before a run, no answer if jog required.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice