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The Frog CNC Router

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by Neil Rosenberg, Jan 3, 2014.

  1. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    DXF, IGS and STEP format files are now in the "Files" area for download. They're in one zip file. Enjoy!
     
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  2. Nick Lancaster

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    We need video! Because other then Kram you have your machine the furthest along!
     
  3. matt_o_70

    matt_o_70 New
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    Neil was kind enough to publish the DXF, IGES, STP formats. These are the closest thing to universal formats that exist. Most CAD programs can ingest either format with out any of the following work arounds.

    I played with eDrawings a bit and discovered that there is a work around - to use it to output files from his original models which you can then measure or modify. I posted over in the tutorials section:

    http://www.openbuilds.com/threads/solidworks-edrawings-viewer-to-sketchup.351/

    I posted this info with the hope that it may benefit anyone looking to work with these files with only freely available software. It's a little bit of work but it can be done.

    Then you can generate files you can use to get CNC cut.
     
    #33 matt_o_70, Jan 30, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2014
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  4. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Glad you were able to read the files.

    Looks like the version you used of the Side Plate is from an earlier rev, or you removed the "hog holes" that I put in to reduce weight. With 1/4" aluminum plate, the extra material is not needed for suitable stiffness.

    The dimensions in your Sketchup drawing look good -- overall 14.7" x 8" for the Side Plate and 6.75" x 7.5" for the Gantry Carriage Plate. The height of the Side Plate is derived from my specific bed, which is thicker for the vacuum table. As Mark mentions in one of his videos, it's best to keep the routing location as close as possible (vertically) to the z-axis support wheels. In other words, if you plan to use a thinner bed, you may want to decrease the Side Plate height and thus lower the wheels.

    Important: the hole diameters in my models were selected to allow post-machining for bearings, threading, screw clearance and such. If anyone plans to make a Frog, I urge you to adjust the hole specs for your specific process. You can check out the purpose of each hole by looking at the final assembly. Sorry, most of the hardware is not included in the models -- if you have questions, let me know and I'll respond asap. Also, you may be able to figure it out from the photos, which I plan to supplement soon.

    I will also post a video of the thing in action. I'm not running it at full speed yet, need to get some sharp bits!

    Neil

    P.S. I have done some preliminary testing of the vacuum table. As long as I cover all unused holes (with plastic sheeting) it works really well!
     
  5. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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  6. matt_o_70

    matt_o_70 New
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    Mark - Sure I would be glad to - Posted in tutorials..

    Neil - I do like the vacuume table concept and seeing the under slung motors I am thinking that one option is to replicate the mounting hole patten for the crossbeam so that it could be mounted in a high or lower position depending on the bed in use.
     
  7. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Thanks Matt :)
     
  8. matt_o_70

    matt_o_70 New
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    Neil - Thanks so much for posting your files!

    I am working up things from your side plate files for my own build. I am doing this in SketchUP and will share them if anyone is interested. I like the concept leaving some material under the gantry next to your motor mounts just in case I ever want to connect the plates with additional extrusions to better box the gantry assembly. These cross braces Could also be used to drive the gantry with ACME screws under the bed if someone wanted to go that way. I have not priced out the ACME screws vs belt & pinion drive parts yet.

    upload_2014-2-1_11-51-43.png

    I also took Mark's comments in to account and figured I'd add a second set of Y axis mounting holes in the side plates so that it's possible to choose a high or low location for the gantry extrusion based on what style of spoil board or bed is chosen for a build.
     
  9. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Looks great Matt, can't wait to see how the design evolves under your care! I also have thought about using a leadscrew rather than belt on the y-axis, but for now the belt is performing quite nicely.

    I'll post videos soon of both routing operations and the Donek Drag Knife (a cool tool!). No surprise, with a sharp router bit I can cut really fast and still maintain accuracy.

    Also the vacuum table has not disappointed, amazing how firmly it holds parts! I've ordered a standalone 3-stage vacuum (http://www.centralvacuummotor.com/Lighthouse/LH6765-13.JPG) for the table, should arrive soon. Word on the street is that Shop-Vacs have a nasty habit of bursting into flames when you restrict airflow for a prolonged run.

    I'm also building a dust shoe, I'm drowning in sawdust. Here's my starting point: http://www.instructables.com/id/More-stable-dust-collection-boot-for-CNC-routers/

    If it's of interest, here's the super cheap 4-axis driver I'm using. It's gotten LOTS of bad press, but so far it's behaved really well, no errors or problems at all: http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-Axis-CNC-...458?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c797b8642

    Enjoy!
    Neil
     
  10. Nick Lancaster

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    #40 Nick Lancaster, Feb 2, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2014
  11. Sage

    Sage Well-Known
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    Where?
    Fixed, Thanks!
     
    #41 Sage, Feb 2, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2014
  12. Nick Lancaster

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    Updated my post with the link! Swear I pasted it in!!
     
  13. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Here's a short video showing some of the features of The Frog, hope you can see it ok:

     
    #43 Neil Rosenberg, Feb 2, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2014
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  14. Sage

    Sage Well-Known
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    Nice, looking great Neil. I'm interested in any details you can provide on the z axis rack and pinion setup. How did you attach the rack? Bolt completely through the extrusion? Once attached, how did you tension the pinion against it? Lastly, you said you are using cat5 to run the stepper power, are you using stranded line? Or do you think that the cable chain will protect against breaking solid copper lines?
    Thanks!
     
  15. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Glad you like the machine, thanks :)

    The rack is attached to 1/8" flat plate (threaded holes), which is in turn attached to the extrusion via Tee-nuts and screws. It's pretty easy to slide closer or further away to adjust gear engagement, then locked in place. I haven't observed any shifting. If you download the models I posted you may be able to see the details.

    For motor cabling I used Cat6 stranded 24AWG, forming 4 pairs of 2 conductors each. I don't expect to have breakage problems. I did solder tin the ends where it attaches to the driver box. The RJ45 connectors are clean and easy.
     
    #45 Neil Rosenberg, Feb 2, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2014
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  16. Nick Lancaster

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  17. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Thanks Nick :D

    Also, cool thread on the dust shoe, definitely gonna grab some ideas from that one!
     
  18. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder
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    Well done!
    Looking good, great job on the vac table.
    I'm going to give pods a try myself.
    Just need to get my hands on a vac pump and fittings :)
    Plan is to use extrusion as the base ,pods will slide in, lock down, hose down channels to protect them
     
  19. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Thanks Robert, I'm still figuring out the best ways to use the vacuum table, so far the results are promising.

    Hadn't seen Podz before (newbie!), they look like a nice solution, very flexible. Keep us informed as you progress please.

    BTW my wife is a quilter, she uses a porous stiffener called "Peltex" in some of her projects. What I've found is that a layer of Peltex (search for it on Google) between the vacuum table and the workpiece allows me to cut all the way through the piece into the Peltex, thus avoiding marring the table surface. The vacuum hold-down is not affected.
     
    #49 Neil Rosenberg, Feb 3, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2014
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  20. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Great job Neil this build turned out great! Thanks for the tip for strapping the router on, your right its not going anywhere with those bad boys on there. You mentioned in the video about the debris in the rail and I ran into the same issue with the OX build so the plan is to add a strip of thin plastic along the slot with perhaps a small be to cover everything up nice and neat.
    Thanks for the build very cool of you to share it. :thumbsup:
     
  21. Robert Hummel

    Robert Hummel Custom Builder
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    I was thinking the same thing and plane on using some of the leftover acrylic from the Laser V build.
     
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  22. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    I have found that the dust shoe has largely eliminated dust getting into the tracks, glad I added that. Notice the two neodymium magnets -- I have holes for 4 but that was WAY too strong. I'm re-doing the brush soon, it's a balancing act between too-stiff and not stiff enough. Also, I've added some new comments over in the build description area, plus a photo of a new vacuum motor and my first 3d contouring project. Onward!

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  23. Tweakie

    Tweakie OpenBuilds Team
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    Excellent dust shoe and beautiful job with the 3D crest Neil :thumbsup:

    Tweakie.
     
  24. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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  25. Nick Lancaster

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    looking good. How loud is that vacuum for the table?
     
  26. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    Hard to be precise. It's not as loud as a shopvac, mostly due to the muffler.

    Anyway, the router is quite loud so I wear Peltor earmuffs when I'm working.
     
  27. Nick Lancaster

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    you think that little router is loud? My big CNC router uses a 2.25hp router. you can hear it next door.

    Earmuffs, required CNC accessory.
     
  28. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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  29. zach

    zach New
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    Neil,
    Can you post the acceleration ramp for your 270 oz stepper motors? I asked automation technology, where I bought mine from, and they said to try it on Mach 3 because they don't have the acceleration ramps. I am using a usb controller and dont have mach 3.
     
  30. Neil Rosenberg

    Neil Rosenberg Journeyman
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    No problem.

    Having some trouble inserting full size images, please have a look in the build description photos, I'm putting them there.

    You may also be able to get them here:
    http://pho.to/4l64K/ma
    and
    http://pho.to/4l64j/ql

    The parameters may change when I switch to the 3mm GT2.
    Let me know if you can't read this, or need more info.

    Neil
     
    #60 Neil Rosenberg, Feb 15, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2014

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